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01: danbenau

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Subject: RE: My sick rat terrier Jack
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Lance


Rattie
Rattie
12/31/2009 2:17 AM RE: My sick rat terrier Jack  
Original Post Content Deleted
luvmyratties


Ratastic
Ratastic
05/17/2011 11:23 AM RE: My sick rat terrier Jack  
It sounds like he has hurt his back not his neck. I sure hope the vet can find the problem quickly. May need to insist on some Xrays.

Ginger

owned by Ratties; Little Man,Prissy Lee, Chloe and Ray Charles and the Boxers; Walker and Maggie Mae
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donlon04


Rattie
Rattie
05/17/2011 11:34 AM RE: My sick rat terrier Jack  

I think I will insist on x-rays.  I feel so bad for him.  He sat on my lap all last evening.  Usually he doesn't sit for that long without going to get his balls to play catch.  He is definitely hurting.  He is outside more chasing squirrels and digging now so hopefully it is just a strain and not something neurological. Poor guy. Kat

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WendyandMardi


Terrier Terror
Terrier Terror
05/17/2011 1:30 PM RE: My sick rat terrier Jack  
My Aunts dog got constipated and hunched and he turned out to have some sort of regional disease I forgot the name. He got better but it took a while to diagnose.
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donlon04


Rattie
Rattie
05/17/2011 2:00 PM RE: My sick rat terrier Jack  

Our vet wants to see him again tonight .  They don't like the sound of what he is doing.  So hopefully bloodwork and an x-ray may show more.  I am hoping it is nothing serious.  I have looked everywhere on-line and different things come up.  Vestibular Syndrome sounded similar to what he is doing but so do other things.  Hopefully we can get some answers.  Thanks for the comments!

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Philo


Feisty
Feisty
05/17/2011 2:22 PM RE: My sick rat terrier Jack  

I'm sorry your coming to the site under such circumstances.  Since your Jack was healthy and doing well up until recently let's hope it is a treatable injury.  Our Jack has problems with his lower back and just recently went through a bout of a really stiff, sore neck, to the point he was crying.  A prednisone injection and a two week regimen of pills, plus pain pills helped him heal.  Is he doing any neck strains pushing his head up?  Let's hope your vet can get to the bottom of this and get your little man feeling better.


Rattie Daddy to Kiara Rose, Briar Rose, Nala Belle & Woody
Rest in peace sweet Girl Baby Cameo Nora 10/24/07-11/06/09 ~ Jack Goodboy 11/27/00-11/02/2014
Rest in peace Little Master Cutter Bug With us from Aug 2, 08 to Nov 17, 09 ~ Rest in Peace Rattagan Lee 2/16/1997-3/29/2011

"Beauty such as this is a gift, and I'm often in awe of this world we've been given." Mrs Bonnie
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donlon04


Rattie
Rattie
05/17/2011 3:01 PM RE: My sick rat terrier Jack  

No he isn't doing any neck stretches or strains but won't shake his head like he usually does.  He just looks stiff and a bit hunched.  He also is not wanting to jump up or down on his normal resting area on his couch with his sister, beagle Abby.  He turns around like to have us pick him up.  He is quite funny and smart.  He does like attention and sometimes puts on more of an act for me than for my husband but this is no act, he really has something going on and I can't take the sad face.  He has always been a very healthy and energetic ratty so thanks for the encouragement.  It's just hard to see him sick.  I'm hoping to get more info tonight. 

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Ralphy


Ratterific
Ratterific
05/18/2011 7:37 AM RE: My sick rat terrier Jack  
Does he hold his head lower than normal when standing or walking?

How does he go from the laying down position to standing up? What about from standing up, to laying down....does he do it slowly? Does he lower his chest to the ground first?

Does he back up if you try to pick him up?

Is he eating normal?

Does he look like he strains to poo? Any accidents inside?

Is he reluctant to jump on furniture or go up and down stairs?

Does he stand in a hunched position for long periods of time, not wanting to move?

If it is a neck or a back problem, you'll be able to pick up on the symptoms. If it were me, I would keep him crated for the next week until you at least get some x-rays. X-rays don't always show the problem though......he may require an MRI for you to pinpoint the exact problem. Let us know more of his symptoms so that we can try and guide you in the right direction.

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donlon04


Rattie
Rattie
05/18/2011 10:53 AM RE: My sick rat terrier Jack  

Last night he was seen by a second vet.  He thinks it is his back right lower joint.  He could hear clicking.  He took bloodwork but no x-ray yet.  He said he will see what the lab work comes back at but that is how he is leaning and that it may need repaired at a tune of $1,200.  My beagle had both her knees repaired 4 years ago and what a tough time keeping her down during recovery.  I do want to make sure they x-ray though to be sure before they go doing major surgery.  He keeps falling regularly now to the side and tries to scramble to his feet but seems he can't find his legs.  He's my baby and I just can't stand to see him this way.  He loves his back yard so much and it will be a hard summer if iy goes this route but I will do whatever it takes to get him better.  Neither of my dogs have ever been crated so they would freak if I tried that.  As far as the other questions, yes, he is eating, no he isn't jumping up and down on things, yes he sits hunched and stiff and when he goes to stand is when he falls. Poor little Jack, Kat

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Lucylu


Firehouse Big Dog
Firehouse Big Dog
05/18/2011 11:32 AM RE: My sick rat terrier Jack  
Aww poor thing, but it looks like you have a pool, would water therapy be an option for his exercise.
Keep us updated, and good luck.

Layla
Mommy to Lucy, Fiona, Kip, Cassie, and Angel Sally
Rest in Peace my sweet Sally (June 4, 1998-October 18, 2013)
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donlon04


Rattie
Rattie
05/18/2011 11:55 AM RE: My sick rat terrier Jack  

We live in NH so pool days are limited weather wise.  If we are lucky like last summer we could get some time in for sure.  We have life vests for them.  As you can see he loves to relax in it. hahaha.   

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Philo


Feisty
Feisty
05/18/2011 6:41 PM RE: My sick rat terrier Jack  

Swimming is good physical therapy!  We figured out that a bath tub can be used for swimming therapy, possibly, maybe.  I'm surprised the vet was talking surgery without any x-rays, unless Jack just couldn't handle it then.  Ralphy, who checked in earlier, went through almost a year of recovery and recuperation after a back injury.


Rattie Daddy to Kiara Rose, Briar Rose, Nala Belle & Woody
Rest in peace sweet Girl Baby Cameo Nora 10/24/07-11/06/09 ~ Jack Goodboy 11/27/00-11/02/2014
Rest in peace Little Master Cutter Bug With us from Aug 2, 08 to Nov 17, 09 ~ Rest in Peace Rattagan Lee 2/16/1997-3/29/2011

"Beauty such as this is a gift, and I'm often in awe of this world we've been given." Mrs Bonnie
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InMuk


Ratastic
Ratastic
05/18/2011 8:39 PM RE: My sick rat terrier Jack  

Do you have or know a Chiropractor ?

Some Chiropractors do treat animals. I know of a dog who was thrown around in a minor car accident a couple years ago. The dog could hardly walk after the accident. The Vet said the dog would require back surgery. The dog's owners happened to mention tje dog's injury to their Chiropractor. Their Chiropractor offered to treated the dog (massage, heat & ice), then showed the owners how to massage the dog themselves. The dog was moving much better after the first treatment, and was back to normal with in a couple days. The dog is still going great.

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peggan


Rattie
Rattie
05/18/2011 8:58 PM RE: My sick rat terrier Jack  
Sometimes I think vets kind of rush to promote surgery... and I agree that surgery without x-rays sounds odd. My Daisy had a back knee injury 1 month ago now (a torn ACL) and we opted not to go the surgery route. So far, she is improving slowly but surely, and now only holds the leg up occasionally. We have been as strict as possible about NO RUNNING, but she still goes nutso every once in awhile before we can catch her and contain her in her pen (we have a "play pen" for her).

I am not saying that you shouldn't go the surgery route, only that sometimes there are alternatives.

I hope you find the cause and treatment soon for your little guy!

Peggy
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ShellyeJo


Terrier Terror
Terrier Terror
05/19/2011 12:16 AM RE: My sick rat terrier Jack  
A chiropractor might be able to do wonders. I love mine! I would definitely seek a second opinion on any surgery. Especially since they didn't even do x-rays yet.
I've got a very conservative vet for which I'm thankful.
I hope he starts feeling better soon. I love the pool picture. He looks very relaxed in it.

Mom to Tucker (Rattie/Chi), Maddy (Rattie), & Jackson (Ridgeback Mix)
RIP Lucky (Chi) 06.04.10
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oscar


Rattie
Rattie
05/19/2011 6:04 AM RE: My sick rat terrier Jack  
I agree that you should get a second opinion. Hope everything goes right for you and him and that it's just a minor fix.
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donlon04


Rattie
Rattie
05/19/2011 9:04 AM RE: My sick rat terrier Jack  

Ok, the more I observe him, I do not think it is his leg.  I am not saying that Vet doesn't feel something there and later he may have issues but he is showing no signs of a hurt leg.  He told me to feel the muscle mass on the right leg and see the difference to the left.  To my eye and feel it wasn't obvious but I know he is the expert.  However, he would favor or hold it up or lick it or whine or SOMETHING.  This all appears to be back and neck to me.  He is not balancing right.  He isn't shaking his head or ears like he does normally.  We are having horrible rain right now and he looked like he was trying to shake his head and couldn't.  I dropped one of his treats and he wouldn't bend his neck to get it.  I had to pick it up.  He also is still hunched.  He isn't whining or yelping when held.  He never likes to be picked up all the time. He is perferring it now.  And the biggest thing is he isn't barking hardly at all and everyone with a rat terrier knows they love to make noise at times with that piercing bark we all love.  So I am very frustrated.  I will not let him be operated on.  Crazy.  Blood work was fine.  A bit high on sodium.  Chiropractor sounds interesting.  I think someone I know did that with her elderly dog so I will find out where.  Thank you for all the support.  Oh and a big thing we just related to this.  About three or so weeks ago, our pool collasped.  It is an above ground.  A wave of water came out and Jack was in the path.  He had been looking for chipmunks right where it let go. He was taken by the wave in a pretty fierce way.  It happened so fast but he got up after and was totally fine.  We checked him over and to him it was like a tsunami for sure.  Maybe he did hurt his back or neck and it is just now very aggravated.  Kat

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Philo


Feisty
Feisty
05/19/2011 9:40 AM RE: My sick rat terrier Jack  

Regardless of the cause, Prednisone will provide relief, possibly along with either a pain med and/or a muscle relaxant (Tramadol and Diazepam), dont' mix NSAIDs with Prednisone.  The real question is whether this is physical injury, such as pulled muscle, or neurological (not a happy thought, and sometimes difficult to diagnose).  Getting tumbled around like that can cause physical injury and could have been further aggravated by Jack's normal activity.  Do you have a vet hospital with specialists nearby?  I know you said he's been healthy, has he had any bouts with either fungal or bacterial infection?


Rattie Daddy to Kiara Rose, Briar Rose, Nala Belle & Woody
Rest in peace sweet Girl Baby Cameo Nora 10/24/07-11/06/09 ~ Jack Goodboy 11/27/00-11/02/2014
Rest in peace Little Master Cutter Bug With us from Aug 2, 08 to Nov 17, 09 ~ Rest in Peace Rattagan Lee 2/16/1997-3/29/2011

"Beauty such as this is a gift, and I'm often in awe of this world we've been given." Mrs Bonnie
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donlon04


Rattie
Rattie
05/19/2011 9:47 AM RE: My sick rat terrier Jack  

Right now he is on a muscle relaxant and something for pain but not prednisone.  My vet office is small but is a partner to the bigger one a town away.  The doctor that saw him last travels between the two.  I know a breeder of goldens and I think I will call her and see where she has her dogs seen.  She lives in Maine, right over the border from me.  He hasn't had any fungal or bacterial infections that I am aware of.  He does get irritations under his arm pits at times that we have to spray but he's always been so healthy.  Some ear things years ago that we had to treat.  I pray not neurological.  This was all just so sudden.

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banjorat


Terrier Terror
Terrier Terror
05/19/2011 9:51 AM RE: My sick rat terrier Jack  
Perhaps the pool tsunami caused some injury that created a weakeness, but with no noticible symptoms. Then he did something that aggrevated the weakness and now you are seeing the symptoms.
I know a lot of us have sciatica pain and until the pinched nerve is unpinched, can do very little. I would definately seek out a second opinion and contact a chiropractor.
I hope Jack mends soon.
Lorna

I never knew what I was missing until Pepper was literally dropped in my lap.....Life is good.
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banjorat


Terrier Terror
Terrier Terror
05/19/2011 9:51 AM RE: My sick rat terrier Jack  
Perhaps the pool tsunami caused some injury that created a weakeness, but with no noticible symptoms. Then he did something that aggrevated the weakness and now you are seeing the symptoms.
I know a lot of us have sciatica pain and until the pinched nerve is unpinched, can do very little. I would definately seek out a second opinion and contact a chiropractor.
I hope Jack mends soon.
Lorna

I never knew what I was missing until Pepper was literally dropped in my lap.....Life is good.
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allnew2me


Rat-A-Tat-Tat
Rat-A-Tat-Tat
05/19/2011 11:32 AM RE: My sick rat terrier Jack  
Has anyone looked deeply into his ears? Years ago, I had a cat who had neurological symptoms, and it turned out to be a tick way down in one ear that caused an infection, and it was affecting his balance. He kept falling off the furniture, and wobbling when he walked.

"If you don't own a dog, at least one, there is not necessarily anything wrong with you, but there may be something wrong with your life.” (Roger Caras)

Shirley -- Jubal's mom-person
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donlon04


Rattie
Rattie
05/19/2011 11:53 AM RE: My sick rat terrier Jack  

When I take him back I will have them look again.  They said his ears looked fine but all these things make sense.  We started tick treatment  about 2 weeks ago.  No reason why one couldn't be lodged in there and die off and lay in the canal.  It's good to check everything out until we solve this.  He is definately wobbly. 

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vccarmi


Bratty Ratty
Bratty Ratty
05/19/2011 12:15 PM RE: My sick rat terrier Jack  
Or perhaps the tick treatment itself? allergic reaction?

My Daisey has twice had a neck strain and she wouldn't lift her head for a treat and seemed to "hunch" her neck back into her body. Pred and muscle relaxers fixed her up both times. Since they really can't tell you what happened, we just had to assume there was some exertion, or injury that caused both instances.

Vickie, Ratbone foster mama
Mama to Eddie & my angel Daisey
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donlon04


Rattie
Rattie
05/19/2011 12:35 PM RE: My sick rat terrier Jack  

He's had the tick treatment every year with no issues but we did get it on late this year.  Wouldn't it be so much easier if they could tell us?  He looks at me like "can't you help me?" 

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Ralphy


Ratterific
Ratterific
05/21/2011 10:39 PM RE: My sick rat terrier Jack  
Posted By donlon04 on 05/19/2011 9:04 AM

This all appears to be back and neck to me.  He is not balancing right.  He isn't shaking his head or ears like he does normally.  We are having horrible rain right now and he looked like he was trying to shake his head and couldn't.  I dropped one of his treats and he wouldn't bend his neck to get it.  I had to pick it up.  He also is still hunched. 


My Ralphy would do the same thing with his head in the beginning stages of his back injury.  He would "gently" shake his head from side to side.  I could tell he wanted to give his a full blown shake, shake, shake (like dogs do), but he would definitely hold back out of fear of hurting himself.  He also would stand hunched over all the time like an old man.  It got to the point where he wouldn't want to eat, and we would have to hand feed him.  We finally elevated his food bowl so he didn't have to bend his neck down so far.  He soon began to eat on his own after we did that. 

My suggestion is to get him on some supplements now so it can work into his body over the next several months.  It won't hurt him, and it's worth the try.  I'm so thankful someone on this board suggested them to me, because I know Ralphy would have needed surgery if it wasn't for these supplements. The ones that I used (and am currently using) for him are Advanced Cetyl-M (1/2 AM / 1/2 PM), DGP (I give this to him on and off, but I don't know if this one really helped him all that much with the pain), and Vetri-disc (1 capsule a day).  I would try this along with strict crate rest before you even think about surgery.  I also recently bought Recovery SA Powder, but have yet to try it with him.  I'll try it after I run out of  the Ventri-disc. 

Ralphy was also on prednisone for a good amount of time.  He really needed the pred for the inflammation.  If I even attempted to take him off the prednisone for a day, his symptoms came right back.  I finally was able to wean him off it completely about a month ago (a very slow process).  He's been doing well on the supplements alone.  In fact yesterday, we went to the beach and he played like a puppy again.  I never thought I would see that day ever again.  It made me so happy to see him back to his old self again. 

Some other suggestions would be to make sure he can't jump anywhere, like on the couch or on people.  Block off stairs if you got 'em for the time being.  And, most importantly give him some good crate rest for a couple weeks.  It's harder on us, than it is on them.  We feel so bad locking them up, but it really is the best thing for them if you want a quick recovery (if it is indeed a back or neck injury).  The crate shouldn't be so big that he can jump around in it.....just enough room for him turn around and lay down. 

I wish you and Jack the best of luck.  It's hard to see our babies in so much pain. 

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Ralphy


Ratterific
Ratterific
05/21/2011 10:47 PM RE: My sick rat terrier Jack  
Oh, and Ralphy also favors his left rear leg even though I don't think there is anything wrong with it. I've never been able to figure out why he does this. I think maybe it somehow takes the pressure off his back to stand this way.....kinda like how people stand hunched over rather than standing straight up if we have back pain. Anyway, he would stand with his left leg pointed outward. He still stands bowlegged at times. I've checked his legs time and time again and nothing seems wrong with them. His posture is just now getting better after getting more exercise after weeks of crate rest.....not perfect, but far better than it was.
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donlon04


Rattie
Rattie
05/25/2011 1:02 PM RE: My sick rat terrier Jack  

Sorry for the long delay.  It has been a real busy time for me with kids graduating from college, etc.   Jack actually had gotten worse after I posted last.  He looked so pathetic and sick and I cried all morning over it because I was fearing the worse.  I called the doctor and insisted on x-rays which they did do right away and fortunately and unfortunately, nothing showed up so we still don't have a clue.  I told them that it was definitely not his leg.  However, they put him on prednisone and the little guy is really doing quite well.  He is more active than I would like.  We don't have crates because our dogs have never been crated.  He did have one small episode getting up from a laying position this weekend but other than that he wants to be back to business and I am so afraid that when he ends his three weeks of prednisone, he will revert back.  They said if that happened he would need something like an MRI to know better.  The only vets that do it are in Portland, Maine and around $1,200 for one. Yikes. Up to over $700 just last week but he is well worth it.  

Thank you for the supplement list.  I will definitely try that.  Ralphy's symptoms sound very similar to Jack with the hunch and back leg out.  The feeding is the same thing.  We had to lift his bowl up.  Did he fall over?  That just kills me to see.  Plus, he hates the vets and they had to give him something to do the xray.  He never bites but I guess he tried to and I'm sure he is so scared and in pain.  I am praying for the quick recovery of my little guy.  We want him healthy and around for many years to comes. 

 

  

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Philo


Feisty
Feisty
05/25/2011 3:37 PM RE: My sick rat terrier Jack  

Prednisone can work wonders, but it is a powerful drug.  Just curios, has the vet poked and prodded to find a sensitive area on Jack's body?  When I took our Jack to the vet with his neck pains when Doc started poking around on his neck he let Doc know exactly where it hurt!  The pred can cause an increase in appetite sometimes.


Rattie Daddy to Kiara Rose, Briar Rose, Nala Belle & Woody
Rest in peace sweet Girl Baby Cameo Nora 10/24/07-11/06/09 ~ Jack Goodboy 11/27/00-11/02/2014
Rest in peace Little Master Cutter Bug With us from Aug 2, 08 to Nov 17, 09 ~ Rest in Peace Rattagan Lee 2/16/1997-3/29/2011

"Beauty such as this is a gift, and I'm often in awe of this world we've been given." Mrs Bonnie
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donlon04


Rattie
Rattie
05/25/2011 3:50 PM RE: My sick rat terrier Jack  

Well, the original vet did and said it was his neck where she got the reaction and then that was why we were confused when the second one said leg.  But he did say he thought it was his neck at the end of the week and did prod him but he didn't want to injure him more since he was not happy and was trying to get away.  He said the prednisone works different in dogs than in people and not as many bad side affects we have with it.  He was like a different dog but I just hope it isn't masking it.  I try to keep him quiet but he is just naturally active and it's so hard to watch him every second not jump up.  However, he knows not to jump down.  He barks if he wants us to get him down from something.  The little bugger.  He went and got his ball to play and I told him no he couldn't and he kept barking at me to throw it.  Plus, I work so during the day, I can only hope he is quiet.  I know everyone says crate but he would freak out never being in one and we will address it if we need to.  Thanks again.

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