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Rat-Terrier.com
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kp_in_scott

 Firehouse Big Dog

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| 10/01/2008 2:36 PM |
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Living in the rural area that I live in it is difficult to find quality dog food. I am feeding Canidae All Life Stages, but i have noticed with the last bag of food that I got, the pellets seem to be kinda powdery. I assume that this is related to the last change that Canidae had to it's formula. I found another dog food that I can get locally called "Maximum Nutrition".
Listed ingredients: Lamb, chicken meal(natural source of glucosamine), ground whole grain sorgham, brewers rice, ground barley, chicken fat(preserved with mixed tocopjerols and citric acid), dried beet pulp, carrots, natural flavor, ground flaxseed, peas, potassium chloride, dried egg product, brewer's yeast, salt, blueberry pmace, monocalcium phosphate, taurine, Vitamin E supplement, zinc sulfate, ferrous sulfate, zinc oxide, choline chloride, proteinated minerals,(zinc, manganese, copper), niacin, copper sulfate, Vitamin A supplement, biotin, calcium pantothenate, manganous oxide, Vitamin B12 supplement thiamine mononitrate(source of Vitamin B1) pyridoxine hydrochloride(source of Vitamin B6) menadione sodium bisulfite complex(source of Vitamin K activity), riboflavin supplement(source of Vitamin B2) sodium selenit, calcium iodate, folic acid, Vitamin D3 supplement, cobalt carbonate.
I used the following scale and the food got a score of 103 (if I did it right)
Start with a grade of 100 points, then …
For every listing of "by-product", subtract 10 points
For every non-specific animal source ("meat" or "poultry", meat, meal or fat) reference, subtract 10 points
If the food contains BHA, BHT, or ethoxyquin, subtract 10 points
For every grain "mill run" or non-specific grain source subtract 5 points. If the same grain ingredient is used 2 or more times in the first five ingredients (i.e. "ground brown rice", "brewer's rice", "rice flour" are all the same grain), subtract 5 points
If the protein sources are not meat meal and there are less than 2 meats in the top 3 ingredients, subtract 3 points
If it contains any artificial colorants, subtract 3 points
If it contains ground corn or whole grain corn, subtract 3 points
If corn is listed in the top 5 ingredients, subtract 2 more points
If the food contains any animal fat other than fish oil, subtract 2 points
If lamb is the only animal protein source (unless your dog is allergic to other protein sources), subtract 2 points
If it contains soy or soybeans, subtract 2 points
If it contains wheat (unless you know that your dog isn't allergic to wheat), subtract 2 points
If it contains beef (unless you know that your dog isn't allergic to beef), subtract 1 point
If it contains salt, subtract 1 point
Extra Credit:
If any of the meat sources are organic, add 5 points
If the food is endorsed by any major breed group or nutritionist, add 5 points
If the food is baked not extruded, add 5 points
If the food contains probiotics, add 3 points
If the food contains fruit, add 3 points
If the food contains vegetables (NOT corn or other grains), add 3 points
If the animal sources are hormone-free and antibiotic-free, add 2 points
If the food contains barley, add 2 points
If the food contains flax seed oil (not just the seeds), add 2 points
If the food contains oats or oatmeal, add 1 point
If the food contains sunflower oil, add 1 point
For every different specific animal protein source (other than the first one; count "chicken" and "chicken meal" as only one protein source, but "chicken" and "fish" as 2 different sources), add 1 point
If it contains glucosamine and chondroitin, add 1 point
If the vegetables have been tested for pesticides and are pesticide-free, add 1 point
Scoring
94-100+ = A
86-93 = B
78-85 = C
70-77 = D
69 = F
Doesn't score as high as Canidae, but I may be using this in conjunction with the Canidae. I will just have to see. I bought the 20 lb bag just to try out. We shall see....Anybody else seen this food? It's available at Walmart. I've heard nothing about it, no advertising, nothing so I really don't have an opinion about it yet. |
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Kim, owned by one sweet Rattie mix and one sweet Toy Rattie and a house full of parrots |
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ivy

 Bratty Ratty

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| 10/01/2008 2:42 PM |
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this is something I found:
NaturalNews) While it’s a little noticed pet food ingredient, Menadione Sodium Bisulfate (and its many named variations) is one ingredient to look out for and avoid. This ingredient is commonly found in many dog foods, cat foods, and treats. Unfortunately, it doesn’t have the best reputation for being a safe or useful pet food ingredient. Since there are alternatives for pet food makers to use, it makes you wonder why some put our pets at risk.
Menadione Sodium Bisulfate is a synthetic version of vitamin K. You’ll see it within the fine print of many pet food ingredient lists. In addition, of course, it’s not as simple to find as it should be. Some pet food ingredient lists will say ‘menadione’, some will say ‘sodium bisulfate’, and some will mention vitamin K3 in parenthesis -- and these are just a few of the possible variations you have to look for.
This ingredient is added to pet foods and treats as an inexpensive source of vitamin K. In people, deficiencies of vitamin K can lead to blood clotting, particularly in the stomach, and can lead to intestinal complications. An example in reference to pets, veterinarians will administer an injection of K1 (not the synthetic K3) to a pet who has consumed a rat poison which causes internal bleeding. Food sources of natural vitamin K (K1) are green leafy vegetables; which are not on the ‘top ten’ list of many pets. Pet food ingredients that could provide natural sources of vitamin K are alfalfa and kelp. However, as you probably have figured out, synthetic vitamin K or menadione is a great deal less expensive than the natural sources of alfalfa and kelp.
Knowing that a pet food company would opt for a synthetic ingredient in contrast to a natural ingredient is bad enough, but it goes one step further on the ‘bad scale’ with Menadione Sodium Bisulfate. This ingredient can be highly toxic in high doses. Hazard information regarding menadione lists “carcinogenic effects” and states “the substance is toxic to kidneys, lungs, liver, mucous membranes. Repeated or prolonged exposure to the substance can produce target organs damage.” |
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RatsRule!

Ratastic

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| 10/01/2008 2:46 PM |
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| I've never heard of it, but personally wouldn't feed it. Its very grain heavy and I'd put my money on the whole grain sorgham coming from corn. I personally don't put much stock in this grading system. Someone here posted a link as to how this system contracdicts itself and has little if any benefit and use, but I can't find it at the moment. I'll keep looking. |
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RatsRule!

Ratastic

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| 10/01/2008 2:50 PM |
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| Just to add to what Ivy said... most vitamins and minerals added to commercial pet foods are synthetic. he processing of pet foods strips them of beneficial vitamins and minerals so they are added back - synthetically -because its cheaper. (At least that is what I have read in many books regarding commercial pet foods) |
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kp_in_scott

 Firehouse Big Dog

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| 10/01/2008 3:00 PM |
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| Thanks for the heads up on the MSB. I just wish that there were a Petco locally. I could get what I needed there. I wouldn't give up living where I am for any thing, but we have a time getting good dog food and parrot food. We have to have that shipped in too and because shipping is so high an 18lb bag of parrot food costs $49. Getting dog food shipped in is a tad cheaper. I will keep looking. Sigh.... |
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Kim, owned by one sweet Rattie mix and one sweet Toy Rattie and a house full of parrots |
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ivy

 Bratty Ratty

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| 10/01/2008 3:08 PM |
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| I HATE SHIPPING cost it is amazing I am looking for glove conditioner for my sons new Baseball glove and it only cost 2.99 but the shipping is 10$ I say no way!!!! I know it does not cost that much to ship a 4 oz bottle of the stuff! |
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gwacie

 Rat-A-Tat-Tat

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| 10/01/2008 3:08 PM |
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| What stores do you have locally Kim? Do you have a Tractor's Supply or something like that? Maybe you can ask the management about carrying something like EVO or Wellness Core or something reasonably high quality. Never hurts to ask, right? |
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gwacie (Bethany) My Doggies: http://www.myadams.net/dogs/ Rescue: http://www.newrattitude.org |
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bluedog

 Rat Royalty

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| 10/01/2008 3:09 PM |
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| It could be the binder in the canidae just not holding together. I had a bag of Evo for my cats that did this - about the last 1/3 was powder so I took it back and they gave me a new bag... if you have to have it shipped, that probably doesn't help. I've moved on to raw. My allergy boy lab cannot handle kibble. |
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Christine Mom to Michael & Charlotte Moose (lab), Paisley (rattie), Clark & Lois (tolerant kitties) |
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Mitzy's Mom

 PAWesome

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| 10/01/2008 3:11 PM |
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Yeah, that menadione is BAD stuff. This Maxximum Nutrition is manufactured by Doane's Pet Care (purchased by Mars in 2006) and they also make Ol Roy - both brands for Wal Mart. I just wouldn't trust it, even without the menadione. BTW - Merrick still ships free within the US. |
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Mary Beth, mom to the Lollipop Kids
Georgia Foster Mom, www.newrattitude.org Pics of my current fosters: http://imageevent.com/newrattitude/caradoc http://imageevent.com/newrattitude/fiona
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kp_in_scott

 Firehouse Big Dog

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| 10/01/2008 3:14 PM |
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| I'll look into the Merrick. Free shipping would off set the increased cost most definately. |
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Kim, owned by one sweet Rattie mix and one sweet Toy Rattie and a house full of parrots |
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My3Rats

 Ratterific

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| 10/06/2008 1:18 PM |
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My Husb and I are trying to find what the best dry foods are. We currently us Nutro Ultra and our dogs like it but we have a dog with allergies, one just started with seizures, third is okay. We just would like to know our options and upgrade our food if needed. I would appreciate names of dry food that is high quality. Thank you!!! |
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Gizmo (9), Squirt (6), Bailey (8)
~~Life is better with dogs~~ |
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My3Rats

 Ratterific

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| 10/06/2008 1:19 PM |
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| Is Merrick a brand of dog food? |
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Gizmo (9), Squirt (6), Bailey (8)
~~Life is better with dogs~~ |
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Mitzy's Mom

 PAWesome

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| 10/06/2008 1:26 PM |
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Posted By My3Rats on 10/06/2008 1:19 PM
Is Merrick a brand of dog food?
Yes, Merrick is a brand of high quality dog food: http://www.merrickpetcare.com/store/dry_dog_food.php
Others would be: Innova/EVO/California Naturals, Nature's Variety, Taste of the Wild, Natural Balance, Wellness, Orijen and a bunch of others I can't remember. |
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Mary Beth, mom to the Lollipop Kids
Georgia Foster Mom, www.newrattitude.org Pics of my current fosters: http://imageevent.com/newrattitude/caradoc http://imageevent.com/newrattitude/fiona
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My3Rats

 Ratterific

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| 10/06/2008 1:30 PM |
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Posted By Mitzy's Mom on 10/06/2008 1:26 PM
Posted By My3Rats on 10/06/2008 1:19 PM
Is Merrick a brand of dog food?
Yes, Merrick is a brand of high quality dog food: http://www.merrickpetcare.com/store/dry_dog_food.php
Others would be: Innova/EVO/California Naturals, Nature's Variety, Taste of the Wild, Natural Balance, Wellness, Orijen and a bunch of others I can't remember.
Any of these are fine? Equally fine??
Thanks so much for the names. I will let you know what we pick. 
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Gizmo (9), Squirt (6), Bailey (8)
~~Life is better with dogs~~ |
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Mitzy's Mom

 PAWesome

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| 10/06/2008 6:03 PM |
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IMO they are all good foods. Best thing to do is research foods and choose one based on the quality plus what is good for your dogs (for example I don't feed grains in food because I have a little girl who is grain-sensitive). You can go to http://www.dogfoodproject.com/index.php?page=badingredients and find a list of ingredients to avoid in foods...like by-products, preservatives, wheat/corn/soy gluten and other things. This site will also explain how to read dog food labels.
Most foods found at grocery stores will be heavy on corn/wheat fillers and grain in general. The worst ones also have the preservatives, by-products (this can even be euthanized pets, road kill, feathers, beaks, etc.) Examples of some bad foods would be Pedigree, Eukanuba, Iams, Science Diet, etc. Not all of these have all the bad stuff but do have a lot of corn and wheat fillers....a cheap way to fill up a dog without providing enough nutrition.
Good luck! |
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Mary Beth, mom to the Lollipop Kids
Georgia Foster Mom, www.newrattitude.org Pics of my current fosters: http://imageevent.com/newrattitude/caradoc http://imageevent.com/newrattitude/fiona
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Tika&Bogie

 Ratastic

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| 10/07/2008 5:14 AM |
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Kim, I have the same problems that you do..I too live WAY out in the boonies and just to get to Walmart or any other "chain" store I have to drive at least 30 to 40 minutes. And, like you..wouldn't trade it for the world but it does pose a problem at times. A small feed/farm store carries Nutro and Natural Balance but they are only open mon. teus. thurs. and friday from 8 til 4 and 1/2 day on saturdays AND they are 40 minutes away..not to mention in a direction that I rarely go...I work at a school system and don't get out of work til :30 and we set up every weekend with our produce at a flea mkt. from 7am to around 2ish..Its not easy for me. |
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Tika & BogiebRat |
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kp_in_scott

 Firehouse Big Dog

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| 10/07/2008 5:29 AM |
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| Well, I'm gonna keep on with the Canidae for now. I can pick it up in Macon when we go for hubby's monthly MD appts. It's just frustrating to know that there are better foods available for my dogs, but just not easily accessable. |
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Kim, owned by one sweet Rattie mix and one sweet Toy Rattie and a house full of parrots |
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Possum

 Rat Royalty

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| 10/07/2008 1:41 PM |
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| I've been feeding Flint River Ranch and get it shipped to the house. Since my big dogs eat it as well as my ratties, now, I can get 40lbs at a time and it sure saves my back. Shipping is free too. It just got too hard for me to get out and find a good quality food at the stores. I live in a rural area too and since I sit with Mom all the time I can't always just pick up and get to the store. Having it shipped to my house has really helped a lot. Price also seems comparable too as well as quality. |
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Peggy - Daisy & Louie's Mom
"Some people walk in the rain, others just get wet" - Roger Miller |
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My3Rats

 Ratterific

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| 10/10/2008 12:55 PM |
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Thank you for all the info!!! I am going to research this weekend and pick a new food. Yippee! |
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Gizmo (9), Squirt (6), Bailey (8)
~~Life is better with dogs~~ |
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