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Recent 'Just Chat'
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If you need help, or have questions, comments or suggestions, please post in the Rat-Terrier.com Info and Help forum.
General Moderators:
Lance
Tracey
Training Moderator:
Nora
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You're Not Alone
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Rat-Terrier.com
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Trix

 Rat Royalty

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| 10/14/2008 12:29 PM |
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Ok, brought him home they sniffed each other everything was good. Trix was trying to take his bone, which wwe corrected. she was also trying to play which he has tried, but is still under the weather. We corrected trix about getting his bone and gave her the one she was chewing on. he is now snapping at her when she goes for his bone, and I correct it, but, now he is becoming territorial of me, i have been correcting that too, like dog wisperer and put him on his side and tell him no. any other suggestions? Don't want this to get rough, i am feeding them both at the same time and taking them out. I took away all the other toys besides the two bones. I just don't want a monster. |
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tiggarat

 Bratty Ratty

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| 10/14/2008 12:36 PM |
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you just got Bajo, right? it usually takes a few weeks for the dogs to figure out pack order, learn house rules, etc...but food/toy aggression is not good. I haven't had to deal with that in a long time, and I know I didn't handle it right. I'm sure Nora will have some good advice on how to deal with that for you.  |
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Lisabeth
furbabies: Lucy and Molly (1 1/2 yr old decker ratties), and Rosie (3 yr old dobie) Buddy - gone but never forgotten.
"I don't think he has any idea he's a dog, really. Of course, he thinks he has a rather odd figure for a man" - Dodie Smith |
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DaisysMom

 Moderator

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| 10/14/2008 12:43 PM |
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Are either or both of them crate trained? Some recommend that dogs only be given special treats like bones/chewies when they are separated as for some dogs it's just asking too much to "allow" another dog to take what is seen as a very valuable resource. Was his snapping very aggressive or appear to be more of a warning? And how did Trix react to his snapping at her? It's still very early in the "integration" process as Bajo has only just arrived, though you are right in wanting to head off potential issues early. As long as you demonstrate your ultimate alphaness over both of them, eventually they will work out between themselves who is higher in the pack order. I would think the odds would be on Trix as the female and original resident dog, but that is not 100%. |
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Tracey - Darlin' Daisy's Mom
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Trix

 Rat Royalty

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| 10/14/2008 12:43 PM |
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I know he isn't feeling well, and honestly, i would not want to be messed with either. So, I feel partial to making trixy leave him alone, but I don't want him to think that he over rules either. when I sit on the floor and try to play, he has to be on my lap, at all times, and as much as I want to cuddle him, I don't want trixy to feel pushed away, so I will take him off my lap and hold trixy. when he is on my lap on the couch, I will call trixy too. but , he has snapped at her,even though i am correcting she is still wiery of him. I don't like that. I want to make sure that I am doing everything I am supposed too. |
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treble02

 Alpha Feist

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| 10/14/2008 12:54 PM |
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My two dogs have NO bone, food, territory agression so when we had Skippy/Nitro (a foster) who WAS posession agressive, I was a little caught off guard. My instinct was to stop the taking, but at the same time, that is a way that they work out the pack order. now, hurting eachother is NOT OK, of course, but taking a bone....im not so sure. I kept Skippy behind a baby gate or in his crate when I gave them bones that way I didnt have to worry about it. I would suggest that for the first little while! I dunno, hope Nora chimes in, but youve already gotten some good advice for sure!  |
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~ Mary, Trixi and Toa's Mommy, PROUD Ratbone Rescues Volunteer!!!
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Tammie

 Ratastic

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| 10/14/2008 12:56 PM |
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I read once that when you have more than one dog you have to let them work out the pecking order and be willing to accept the outcome cause trying to force your will on them can cause confusion on their part. This is difficult to do sometimes, especially when you have a had a dog for sometime and have a bond with that animal, then you bring in a new dog and he/she has other ideas about who should be the alpha dog. Trying to force an alpha to be submissive or visa versa only leads to chaos. This is the reason why I have struggled with the decision to get a second dog. |
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That's my baby girl, Bijou and her little brother Banjo, they are Toy Rat Terriers.
http://www.dogster.com/dogs/749214 http://www.dogster.com/dogs/939035
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Trix

 Rat Royalty

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| 10/14/2008 12:57 PM |
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Trixy is crate trained, I don't know too much about Bajo, but last night he went to bed in his crate, if he wasn't before he will be crate trained. I thought so too. Trixy was our only dog so everything was hers. I corrected Trix for the bone thing. I don't want her to take his things. I saw him take hers too, she didn't do anything. I corrected him took it from him and gave him his and trixy hers. Trixy tried to jump up on my lap and he snapped at her, all of them are more like warnings, than the hair sticking up and snarling. it's just the slight tensness and he never actually touched her. she just turned around and left, sat on the floor and chewed her bone. I don't like that he is acting as though he claiming me. the bones are one thing, but, I don't want one of those dogs that don't let anyone come close to their owner, either. At the same time, i think that he was very mistreated or not payed any attention to where ever her was because he seems to thrive on that. He seems to have that seperation anxiety, not so sure how bad yet, because I have not actually been seperated from him. but last night and today, if i happen to step outside without him, he is at the door scratching and crying, whereever i go he goes, though out the house, he can not loose site of me. my husband and daughter, are different, he look to see where they are going and that is it but if i am out of his sight he starts to get upset. |
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Mitzy's Mom

 PAWesome

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| 10/14/2008 1:47 PM |
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Letting them work it out on their own is the best way as long as you are there to see that it doesn't get too agressive/out of control.
One thing to mention is you need to be careful not to undermine Trix as the alpha.....if you do then she will "turn things up a notch" and it will get worse as she will feel she has to work harder to be alpha....make sense? I made this mistake with my Mitzy when I brought home Skipper. I didn't allow her to snarl at him or allow her to make him sleep at the foot of the bed, etc. So she got worse - she felt she had to. So now I allow her to make her "alphaness" known to each new foster dog and it works. Mitzy (under me as pack leader) determines when they get the priviledge of being allowed up on the couch with her, etc. As long as no one is getting bitten or there is serious fighting going on I don't intervene BUT I watch closely as it can escalate quickly. Body language is very important and knowing when to break things up before it turns ugly but also allowing them room to work it out between themselves.
With Mitzy it doesn't go beyond a snarl, low growl or "beak" with her muzzle. Each foster has either immediately submitted to her or they seem to ignore her but they don't "test" her too much after she's made her will known.
Sorry....didn't mean to write book. |
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Mary Beth, mom to the Lollipop Kids
Georgia Foster Mom, www.newrattitude.org Pics of my current fosters: http://imageevent.com/newrattitude/caradoc http://imageevent.com/newrattitude/fiona
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Tammie

 Ratastic

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| 10/14/2008 2:09 PM |
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Mary Beth, What would you do if a dog seriously challenged Mitzy for the dominant position? I realize you can't let them fight it out like a pack of wolves, but when should you intervene? I once fostered for the Humane Society but at that time I didn't have a dog and only fostered one dog at a time mainly cause it would be very hard for me to stand by and let the dogs work things out if it appeared "my" dog was going to be demoted. |
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That's my baby girl, Bijou and her little brother Banjo, they are Toy Rat Terriers.
http://www.dogster.com/dogs/749214 http://www.dogster.com/dogs/939035
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Trix

 Rat Royalty

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| 10/14/2008 2:33 PM |
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he just did it again, jumped at her, she left, she is just walking around now. he has take posession of the bone, there are two of them!! jeeze!! It is REALLY hard to watch, I just want to cuddle trixy too, so, just let them hash it out, I will tell my husband that too, he was saying not to let them snap at each other. i guess he was wrong, hum, I can't wait to tell him, lol! |
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Mitzy's Mom

 PAWesome

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| 10/14/2008 2:50 PM |
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Posted By Tammie on 10/14/2008 2:09 PM
Mary Beth,
What would you do if a dog seriously challenged Mitzy for the dominant position? I realize you can't let them fight it out like a pack of wolves, but when should you intervene? I once fostered for the Humane Society but at that time I didn't have a dog and only fostered one dog at a time mainly cause it would be very hard for me to stand by and let the dogs work things out if it appeared "my" dog was going to be demoted.
Luckily it has never come to that as Mitzy is very dominant and none of the fosters have seriously challenged her. Alfy has bared her teeth and growled at her over being allowed on the couch but when I see them getting serious (ears pinned, teeth bared, snarls) I picked up Alfy and distracted her. It's not that I mind Mitzy being "demoted" but I don't want her hurt....she's the smallest in the pack. And in the last couple of days I've noticed that sure enough, Mitzy nows allows Alfy on the couch and even sleeps next to her!
Alfy tries to be the "cop" of the pack as well as the "mother". She has gone after Beacan (former foster) for barking while on a walk and also Skipper for barking inside. And she will nip them on the shoulder to discipline them if I don't catch her in time. Doesn't draw blood but they get quiet real fast.
But if a dog came who was extremely alpha/dominant I would have to ask for advice. And keep the newbie crated whenever we werent' there with them.
Trix - when I said to support Trix in her alpha role I was assuming she was alpha. She may not be, in which case she may be ok with Bajo taking her bones, etc. Just pay attention to all the body language...it says a lot. And it can get serious quickly. Good thing is with their small size you can usually grap one up and separate the dogs.
I hope Nora will see this thread as I'm sure she will have some good advice for us! |
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Mary Beth, mom to the Lollipop Kids
Georgia Foster Mom, www.newrattitude.org Pics of my current fosters: http://imageevent.com/newrattitude/caradoc http://imageevent.com/newrattitude/fiona
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Trix

 Rat Royalty

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| 10/14/2008 3:00 PM |
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I really don't know exactly how dominant trixy is, She always just wants to play, most of the time. I saw that min pin with her a few months ago and she was happy she had a playmate but the min pin wanted to dominate, and trixy guarded her territory. after that, they were fine, but trixy didn't just automatically jump on her. she plays well with our friends little dog. we were watching a baby boxer and the boxer tried to dominate over her by trying to stand over her, trixy wasn't even paying attention. she was just chewing over her rope. I have not seen her try to tower over bajo either, nor have i seen him try to do it to her. he had her bone earlier and she was rolling around at him trying to get him to play with her and he just layed there with the bone next to his face. right now she is sitting with me and Bajo is laying on the floor taking a nap, he doesn't even care that she is up here. but it seems that when he is up here with me (on the sofa) he doesn't want her there. is theat wierd? funny, he was so shy at the shelter, lol. i hada feeling that it would be like this. |
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Trix

 Rat Royalty

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| 10/14/2008 3:11 PM |
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trixy is being a little brat. Bajo is sleeping on the floor trixy is laying on the sofa next to me. with her bone. she kees dropping right like on him or by him, I was picking up until i realized what she is doing, so right now she is watching him to see what he will do, because this last time, she dropped it right on his head. he won't do anything. but lay there and now he has the bone right by his mouth again. so trix is just laying there. I seriously think she did that on purpose though, throwing "her' bone at him. is that bizarre? |
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DaisysMom

 Moderator

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| 10/14/2008 3:13 PM |
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| Maybe she is 'offering' it to him? |
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Tracey - Darlin' Daisy's Mom
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Trix

 Rat Royalty

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| 10/14/2008 3:16 PM |
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yea, i think she just wants to play, it just kind of reminded me of my kids when wants to be left alone. it is like, trixy, quit throwing the bone as bajo, leave him alone! in fact, i know she wants to play, any time she sees him starting to get excited, she is right there, ok are you ready to play now????? funny! |
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treble02

 Alpha Feist

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| 10/14/2008 3:19 PM |
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theyre definitly testing eachother and getting to know eachother. Trixi "brings" Toa toys when she wants to play. She will drop them in front of them, and when he takes them, she just takes them back and runs, shes not being bad shes just initiating play. Also, Bajo probably isnt trying to be "mean" he is just being dominant or trying to find his place with her. I agree that letting them work it out is best unless they are crossing the line. THere will be lots of playing, wrestling and growling, but it doesnt mean theyre "fighting" Trixi growls at Toa all the time but wouldnt hurt a flea! heheh....good luck...I was FREAKING OUT when I first got Toa. I thought we had made the WRONG decision because I felt so bad for him. She was OBSESSED with him and CONSTANTLY wrestling with him for about 3 days straight. I really had a rough time, but now their the best of friends!   |
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~ Mary, Trixi and Toa's Mommy, PROUD Ratbone Rescues Volunteer!!!
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DaisysMom

 Moderator

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treble02

 Alpha Feist

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| 10/14/2008 3:25 PM |
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http://www.rat-terrier.com/Home/tabid/37/forumid/5/postid/327896/view/topic/Default.aspx http://www.rat-terrier.com/Home/tabid/37/forumid/5/postid/327291/view/topic/Default.aspx Here are two other threads when I was having issues with Skippy and my two! Hope its helpful! |
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~ Mary, Trixi and Toa's Mommy, PROUD Ratbone Rescues Volunteer!!!
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Trix

 Rat Royalty

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| 10/14/2008 3:29 PM |
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Thank you guys I am going to read up! |
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