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If you need help, or have questions, comments or suggestions, please post in the Rat-Terrier.com Info and Help forum.
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Training Moderator:
Nora
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You're Not Alone
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Rat-Terrier.com
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k_dmom33

 Terrier Terror

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| 10/03/2008 10:36 AM |
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for Jack! I dont know if I agree with this. It seems so....well...mean! I guess I should tell you what is going on. Well, Jack used to bark at kids when they would come to our house. It was frustrating because my 7yr olds friends were scared of him. So I worked with him and he got better. Never was in love with kids, but tolerant. I would just tell the kids to let him come to them, pet him and talk nice to him give him a treat and dont bug him all the time. It was going well. Well, now he barks very viscously sounding to EVERYONE who walks in the door. I've squirted him with a bottle and it works...for the moment. If I know someone is coming I put him in the utitlity room away from everyone and slowly introduce him after the person is here. When he sees the person...off he goes toward them sounding like hes about to kill. My 19yr old step-daughters friend is scared to come in our door because he acts like he is going to bite her. She opens the door and if Jack is coming at her she stays outside until I get him put away. My husband said he's worse about it when I am here, that Jack listens better to him when Im gone. Im the ONLY one Jack doesnt bark at when I come home. Let me make myself clear, he's not just barking hes snarling. My mother in law was afraid to come in the other day because she thought Jack was going to bite her. I know I've had a similar prob with this before, and I thought I had him under control, but he seems worse now. My husband is afraid that he will bite one day and Im kinda worried about that too. I think its time to consult with Ceasar Millan!
I know I've asked for help for a similar situation before...I guess Im wondering if he will ever get over this or if I will have to work with him constantly. And any opinions on shock collars would be apprectiated....tho I dont know if I am for that idea. |
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~~Teresa~~ |
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gwacie

 Rat-A-Tat-Tat

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| 10/03/2008 10:40 AM |
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| I'd get citronella before I got shocker. |
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gwacie (Bethany) My Doggies: http://www.myadams.net/dogs/ Rescue: http://www.newrattitude.org |
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SuzieRedhead

 Bratty Ratty

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| 10/03/2008 10:40 AM |
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Acccccccccck! Shock collars! Try citronella spray bark collars - they work great for me. I have 4 of 'em... much more humane and very effective.
Here's one on Amazon.Com for $35.00 - I just bought one recently myself:
http://www.amazon.com/Premier-Spray-Sense-Anti-Bark-Collar/dp/B0002D31QU/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&s=home-garden&qid=1223048164&sr=8-1
Please try this one first before going to the shock collar!! |
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Sue Carello, Scotia, NY (near Albany) Ratbone Rescues Fostermom, etc... www.ratbonerescues.com Fostermom to Oh Mickey (ADOPTED!), Prince and Spring Ratbone
Who do YOU GoodSearch/GoodShop for? Go to www.goodsearch.com and type in Ratbone Rescues! |
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swatson6

 Attention Starved

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| 10/03/2008 10:41 AM |
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| I don't have a lot of advice and I am sure others will chime in, but I personally don't see how a shock collar would be a good idea. Especially since he is obviously overprotective and scared of others. Shocking him would just add more negative associations with this. Is there any way you could get him a behavioral trainer, one on one in your home? |
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Sarah Mom to Jack, Jeter and foster mom to Teagan
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Mitzy's Mom

 PAWesome

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| 10/03/2008 10:46 AM |
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| I don't see how a shock collar would help him....can you get a trainer or behaviorist to come to your home and work with him and the family? |
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Mary Beth, mom to the Lollipop Kids
Georgia Foster Mom, www.newrattitude.org Pics of my current fosters: http://imageevent.com/newrattitude/caradoc http://imageevent.com/newrattitude/fiona
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k_dmom33

 Terrier Terror

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| 10/03/2008 10:59 AM |
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| thank you guys...I completely agree with this and I just wanted to hear that I was right in how I felt about that! I thought a shock collar would be awful to put on him too. And he's such a little guy. I dont know why he is like this, he's never ever had any negative experiences with people and we've had him since he was 8wks old. And I know the people I got him from and she is an absolute dog lover and has 4 ratties of her own. I thought I had him on the right track with kids. And it started before we got Willy, so its not because of him. Anyway I love the idea of the citronella collar, I am going to def. get that!! That I can handle. I know I would never be able to bring myself to shock my dog...I just couldnt do it. |
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~~Teresa~~ |
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DaisysMom

 Moderator

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| 10/03/2008 11:15 AM |
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Nora is MIA right now, but I'm sure she'll offer some great advice when she gets back I would think rather than either of these collars, perhaps it's best to go back to square one and start over. The crating her or putting her in another room is a good idea, when you know someone is coming over, but I would think that on top of that he should be on a leash when you do let him out so that you can have control over the situation. If someone shows up and knocks at the door, tell them to hold on while you put his leash on. This will make your guests feel more secure and give you control over Jack so that he never has the opportunity to really overreact and bite someone. |
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Tracey - Darlin' Daisy's Mom
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gwacie

 Rat-A-Tat-Tat

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| 10/03/2008 11:19 AM |
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| I absolutely support training over either of the collars. But if you get a collar I'd say NOT the shocker. |
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gwacie (Bethany) My Doggies: http://www.myadams.net/dogs/ Rescue: http://www.newrattitude.org |
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k_dmom33

 Terrier Terror

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| 10/04/2008 8:59 PM |
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I got the spray collar. Its lemon instead of citronella. It was cheaper. So I tried it to see if it would work. Today a girl I work with needed me to babysit her baby and she called me when she was 2 min from my house so I'd have time to put the collar on Jack. I forwarned her about what I was doing. She has never been to my house so this was a perfect test for Jack with the collar. He barked once and it sprayed him. He looked a little confused, and he sneezed. Then he went up to her and barked a second time. it worked again. He walked away from her and not another sound out of him. He didnt go after her legs like he was going to bite her or anything. My co-worker said "great, now hes going to think its me doing it to him"!! But Im glad it worked! |
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~~Teresa~~ |
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Lucy's Mommy

 Terrier Terror

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| 10/04/2008 9:06 PM |
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| Buy a shock collar for your husband. ;0) |
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garyjena

 Terrier Terror

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| 10/04/2008 9:10 PM |
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| I tried the shock collar after being suggested by the trainer we took Geigh to. Of course she was our first dog and we were very naive. Please DO NOT put a shock collar on your dog. Poor Geigh was so scared she would just run to the corner and temble all over and wouldn't come to me for about an hour. It took us about 6 months to get her to let us put a regular collar on her after that. |
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www.newrattitude.org Pet Publicist, Adopt A Pet Volunteer Coordinator Database Maintenance HV and TR |
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rattytatty

 Training Moderator

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| 10/06/2008 1:33 PM |
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Please if you do not know how to correctly use an e-collar, please don't try it. You can totally ruin your dog by using an e-collar without having been shown the correct way to use it. I used an e-collar on Bailey, because he had such poor recall, even after months of traditional training. But I trained the recall verbally and on a long line for a few months before using the e-collar. He already knew the command and what was expected of him. The e-collar simply reinforced it. The primary and most important part of the training, however, was NOT done with an e-collar. Also, because I had never used one before, I called my friend who is a professional trainer who trains police/drug/bomb dogs and asked him to personally walk me through learning to use it. It took 3 times... and Bailey has superb recall. An aggressive dog (and I'm gathering this is what you have based on the content of your thread).... needs a professional trainer (one-on-one sessions) before someone gets hurt. In the meantime... until you get this under control, I would make sure he's crated when children or visitors are around. Put him in his crate BEFORE people enter the house, thereby preventing the opportunity to present itself. E-collars... just like prong/pinch collars... CAN serve as a wonderful training aid. But NOT if you don't know how to properly use one, and NOT if the dog doesn't know to begin with what is expected of him/her. To go out and purchase a shock collar and just shock the dog to keep it from exhibiting a certain type of behavior is very CRUEL and not fair to the dog. |
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~Nora~ Mom to Hoss, Lil'Bit, Buster & Bailey, CGC, OA, OAJ |
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k_dmom33

 Terrier Terror

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| 10/06/2008 2:39 PM |
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| Well, I didnt and I dont intend to ever put a shock collar on Jack. My husband just is misinformed about them. I couldnt do that to my little guy, even though he is aggressive when people come in to our house he really is a sweet loving little dog (with my family) and he's very sensitive. I think a shock collar would ruin him just knowing how he is. He can be very nervous and I think this is why he is like this. We are def. concerned about the aggressivness when someone walks in to the house. Typicaly we do put him in another room when someone comes in, but we have people stop by unannounced often and they know they can just walk in our house. So in they have walked before we knew they were even there. So, we have told people to tell us when they are coming so I can put him away first or leash him and put the spray collar on him before they get here. As of this time we can not afford a professional trainer. I know that is what he needs, and I would love to be able to do it. We just dont have the money for it right now. I just want Jack to not be so freaked out about everybody coming over. That is my one and only issue with him. Every other thing about him is absolutely great. He's great on recall....everything. But this one issue is a major one in my mind. At first we just thought he was barking, but now he seems to have taken on a more aggressiveness way of acting. (if that makes sense.) He would just bark and go the other direction at first hide behind me. Now (since Lacey has died) he is going towards them and snarling. That isnt good. He will stop when I get up and go to him and get between them, but what if Im not here. Anyway, is there any good books that you recommend for me to read? |
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~~Teresa~~ |
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rattytatty

 Training Moderator

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| 10/06/2008 2:50 PM |
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| Seriously, Teresa... a professional trainer might take only a few sessions. A good trainer will show YOU what to do and how to handle the situation, rather than doing it himself unless of course, the situation is so out of control that he has to. I would at least call around and check prices. Getting a trainer in there who can help you for a few hundred dollars really isn't that much when you look at the big picture and what COULD happen if this behavior isn't corrected. |
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~Nora~ Mom to Hoss, Lil'Bit, Buster & Bailey, CGC, OA, OAJ |
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rattytatty

 Training Moderator

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| 10/06/2008 2:59 PM |
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Sorry... I failed to answer your question. Yes there are several good books you can read... one of my favorites is "Healing the Aggressive Dog" by Karen Pryor who is one of my favorite authors. Here's a link to it on amazon.com http://www.amazon.com/Click-Calm-Healing-Aggressive-Clicker/dp/1890948209 Here's a link to another good book.. http://www.dogwise.com/ItemDetails.cfm?ID=DTB850 |
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~Nora~ Mom to Hoss, Lil'Bit, Buster & Bailey, CGC, OA, OAJ |
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yogis mom

 Ratastic

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| 10/06/2008 3:48 PM |
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Those shock collars are terrible in the hands of the untrained... BUT....Those citronella ones sound pretty cool. (Keep the fleas off too!!!?? HEH!)
I recently saw a Victoria Stilwell episode on just that. Their dog lunged & barked at and even nipped people....and barked and snarled. Guests were afraid to come in.
She had the "pack-leader" of the family keep the dog on a long lead at all times...then had people enter....and toss pieces of savory chicken to the dog while walking past (dog was firmly held on lead), and with NO eye contact. Eventually the dog associated guests with treats. (They eventually substituted tossing treats with praise.)
IF the dog lunged or barked, etc he was immediately removed from the room. He soon associated his isolation with his behavior....smart dog!..(Edit ....to add that she would remove him for just a few minutes, then go get him...this she repeated many times until he finally entered the room and behaved) YAY..."EDIT" is back!!!!!!!!!
I don't know if it was just an act for TV, but it appeared to have worked..at least when the cameras returned, 2-3 weeks later, the dog was a totally different dog.
Also....The owners had really worked hard with him....using her techniques.
I agree .... a trainer (behavorial) would be a great help! She,or he, could help you learn different training methods that fit your dog's personality and needs... and your homelife. Hope it works out for your cutie!!!
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k_dmom33

 Terrier Terror

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| 10/06/2008 8:41 PM |
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Well, that does make sense about getting a trainer. I guess I shouldn't really say whether we can afford it or not until I call around and check prices first. Maybe I will call my vet for a referral (if they have one) because if Im going to look into getting a trainer then I want to make sure they are really good at what they do. I love Jack to death and he is totally my dog. If I am home he wont even go outside with anyone else. I have to take him or tell him to go. It frustrates my husband sometimes because he will call Jack to go out and he wont come to him or even the kids. Even if Willy goes he stays by my side. But if I head out he will follow me. or if I call him he will come to me, or if I tell him to go he will. Its kinda funny(not haha funny) how attached to me he is. My hubby and kids say he will whine when I leave and be waiting for me when I get home. I owe this to him....I know. I dont want him to be the dog everyone is scared of or doesnt like because of how he acts when they come in my house. I wonder if its him being protective, or just insecure? And I wonder, can he teach Willy to start acting that way? Because right now Willy loves everyone!! Esp kids. I will check in to a trainer and I will get that book you suggested Nora. I hope I didnt paint Jack out to be a horrible attack dog. He really is quite a love! (with me anyway) |
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~~Teresa~~ |
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k_dmom33

 Terrier Terror

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| 10/06/2008 8:42 PM |
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| Oh and Thanks for your replies everyone! Jack and I both appreciate it! |
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~~Teresa~~ |
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| You are not authorized to post a reply. |
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